#138 How to build your business without social media with Robyn Graham

Welcome to the unapologetically unstoppable podcast. And today I've got a a special guest with us. Dr. Robyn Graham. She is a powerhouse y'all. Dr. Robyn Graham is the founder and owner of Robyn Graham LLC and the creator of the Purpose to Results Success Without Social method. Like what? That's amazing. With an emphasis on mindset, strategy, and action for a one stop business growth coaching.

She helps small business owners grow sustainable businesses for a lifetime of limitless earning potential while having a meaningful impact without a focus on social media. Cause I don't know about y'all, but social media gets me sucked in and then my brain starts going crazy. So that's amazing. Robyn is a business growth strategist and coach host of the globally acclaimed podcast, the Robyn Graham show, a speaker and a bestselling author of you, me, and anxiety.

Take action over anxiety to enjoy being you in which she shares her lifelong journey with anxiety to help others navigate anxiety, to live a joyful, peaceful, purposeful life. When she's not working, you'll find Robyn spending time with her husband, her three children, and her two dogs, and most likely doing an outdoor activity, traveling or enjoying great food.

She's also on the board of directors for face to face Germantown. Welcome Dr. Robyn Graham. I'm so excited to have you here. Thank you, Jeanette. I'm so happy to be here and get to chat with you again yes. Yes. So I think it's, it's kind of cool that we've. We've seen each other on the internet and like we got introduced through a mutual friend and everybody that I've been meeting Lately has been really really solid believers And I think that's the most important thing in my life right now is having those kinds of relationships So I I want to ask you what is your testimony?

Like how did you come to Jesus? And what does that look like and living your life now? Like like when did you start like actually walking with Jesus and not just being a believer? I would say it's been in the past, probably 10 years that it's been a journey. I've known Jesus my whole life, but I didn't have a relationship with Jesus until probably about 10 years ago.

And then I've been growing since. And that all started because you know, as a mom, things were happening in our lives and I needed. Some more reassurance. And I went to devotions. And then as I started doing more and more devotions and just strategizing to be every single day in the word has made a huge difference for me.

And as the years have gone by, my faith has grown, but in the past few years, that relationship, and even the past couple of years, it has just really been like this fire inside me. And A lot of it was learning to an understanding more about the Holy Spirit and how he works and how he's inside me and how much I have in terms of resources from him.

And so, yeah, that's kind of my journey. But also, I will say, like you said, you've been really focusing on hanging out with or talking with other believers who have solid footing. In their faith. And I think doing that for me has been a game changer as well, because I'm not being persuaded to think outside of scripture.

I'm being influenced by other people that are living the word. And that's what I need to be doing every single day. And that has helped me as well. I didn't always live like a Christian lifestyle, if you will, like I would say I was a Christian, but not live the lifestyle. Something in me clicked when I was like, no, I need to be around other believers.

Cause they should be like, no, it's okay if they're not believers. It's, it's not anymore for me. Like I need to, I need that person is going to like check me and remind me that God's got this and remind me with biblical, like word, all the things that he says and his promises when I'm getting that, that spot in my head where I'm just spinning out, like the anxiety, like you talk about.

Absolutely. So tell me a little bit about your book and tell me about how, when you were going through the crux of your anxiety, how God helped you and what that looks like for you.

When I was young, I would say I prayed. And it was always just help me, help me get through this. Help me get out of this, whatever it was, right. Or if, if you help me get out of this, I'll never do anything like this again. You know, that kind of thing. I think we all go through phases like that in our lives, especially when we don't have that solid relationship, like what you and I have grown to have now.

But anxiety was always such a huge part of my life and sometimes   I was unable to navigate it. I would say, and as a result I went through a lot of things where you know I had an eating disorder I absolutely hated myself the body image was terrible was like on and on and on all the negative thoughts that just completely swirl in your head and they don't stop and in the book I use the example of a Ferris wheel, where. You know, you get on a Ferris wheel at a carnival and it'll slow down to let people off and let people on, and then it'll go faster, faster, faster. And then it slows down and lets people off, lets people on. With anxiety, it's like the, it's like that in your brain, except.

There's no stopping or slowing down to let negative thoughts out and positive thoughts in. And so sometimes it feels like you're just trapped in this cycle. And so the, the more I studied the brain, the more I dove into really trying to Fix myself. I discovered that the brain was God's design and he did not design it to be stuck in a cycle of anxious thought he designed it so that we can transform our minds to see him to depend on him to love him and accept his love in return.

And so the stronger I've grown in my faith. It's, it's almost like a pendulum, you know, I'm swinging back towards the middle where everything's coming together and I'm able to manage those anxious thoughts, those anxious and even avoid some of those anxious behaviors that I had before, because I am so at peace with what I have now in terms of my relationship with God.

I love that. I love that so much. I've also struggled with anxiety and depression and. Like, like you said, it's like a Ferris wheel where you're just like in that cycle where you just can't stop the, your brain from thinking those thoughts and I did a lot of therapy and meds and all sorts of things. But like you said, the, the crux of it was always remembering what God says about me and going back to that and being like, this is just my brain spinning out of control.

Like I need to go back to the foundations of God and knowing that he. What he says and take that as, as Bible as word. Yeah, absolutely. And there are times where we do need medication and we do need therapy and we need other people to support us. And, you know, there are so many other things we can do too, with just diet, nutrition, exercise, all of those things.

Sleep, sleep is huge, but sometimes because we're human. We're human and Satan is throwing darts at us constantly. So we have to be in a constant state of taking action to be able to navigate anxiety because if we're just sitting in that place of what if thoughts, we're going to be stuck. And that's the, you know, in the book, I talk a lot about how scripture has helped me and how, you know, just different, different little tools like.

living aligned with our values. You know, like you mentioned before, like sometimes you weren't living like you were a believer. And I think we've all gone through those phases in our lives. And I think it depends on, you know, how they say you're, you're the, the five people, ultimately you're like the five people that you spend most of your time with.

And if we're not spending our time with people that are helping us grow in our faith, most likely we're distancing ourselves from our faith in one way or another. And so. I talk a lot about that in the book that when we align with our values, we're more likely to find peace. We're more likely to avoid what if thoughts, because we're living the way we were called to live.

So good. So good. I agree with you a hundred percent. So you talk a lot about your faith and I noticed that yours, one of your special gifts is faith. So how does that show up for you in your business? Like how do you use your faith in your business and what does that look like to walk out a Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. business. So for me, I th down to a couple of diffe call the Holy Spirit in. things and I'm like, whoa from? Because I know I, y There's a lot of things I don't know and I can do all the research and everything else, but ultimately if I call in Call the Holy Spirit in to help me. He gives me the words.

He gives me the strength. He gives me the patience He gives me all of the gifts that I need to be able to Do the things I need to do. And oftentimes it's like, I don't know what I'm supposed to do here. I don't know what I'm supposed to say here, but even calling in when I have, when I'm meeting with my clients and they're like, I have one client who is completely changing her business model and it is a huge deal.

So like today I'm like, okay. Holy spirit, like activate, I need help. Like, what do I say to help her? How do I help her? How can I best serve her? And I bring in that guidance so that I can be more efficient, more effective. But even for myself, it's believing that anything is possible through him. As entrepreneurs, we all go through these ebbs and flows.

We may have feast or famine in terms of our client book, you know, our book of clients. And so to be able to, to look. at him and be like, okay, I don't know what you're doing with me right now, but I'm gonna sit in it. And I'm going to just keep on plugging away until you tell me something different. And it's, that's a hard lesson to learn.

Because sometimes we want him to talk to us like every single day, all day long. And it doesn't work that way. If we're in a place where he's satisfied with where we are and what we're doing, he may not tell us the next step. We may be right here for a while and it may be uncomfortable. But having that faith to say, Wait, okay.

I know you've got this and I'm just going to wait. So you tell me to go or stop or whatever. I, I just love that you said like, sometimes he doesn't say anything. I think that sometimes like, especially entrepreneurs, we're all like, a lot of us are anyways, type a, we want it. We're go getters. We're highly motivated, very like educated women.

And we're like, all right, what's the next step? All right, I got this. I need two more steps planners. But sometimes God's like, no, just chill right here. Because that's how God talks to me sometimes. Like, no, just chill. And I'm like, OK, God, but are you here? Are you showing up? And sometimes it's like I'm I haven't left.

You're just doing what I need you to do. Noah was Noah was out there building a barge for years. I need you to just chill on this for like a couple of weeks. You know, it's so funny. And I literally just had this like conversation with God and I, I'm a big journaler and that has been instead of meditating, I journal because it's.

And I'm moving, but I'm triggering all the neural pathways in my brain by writing. I'm getting the negative thoughts out, putting them on paper. And so I journal everything, including my prayers. Oftentimes I write out my prayers and that's just how I. I don't know. It just works for me. And it may sound strange, but it works for me.

And I was having this, you know, little conversation and I'm like, okay, am I, am I on the right path? Is this what you want from me? Should I shift gears this year? Am I, you know, whatever. And he's the next day, the next morning I'm in my devotions and this, I read this, this sentence about how. If you're not hearing from me, I am okay with where you are.

Keep going. And I'm like, what? Keep going. Okay. I'll keep going. I don't know what I'm doing, but I'll keep going. Love how God gives us those little, like those reminders and those nudges, especially when we're like, come on, come on, come on. And he's like, no, I already, I already told you you're good. Yeah. I love that.

That was like confirmation almost. Yeah, it was. It was because I was thinking, Oh, maybe I should just focus on this. And then it's like, no, keep doing what you're doing because I want you in place. You're at. So here I am.

Why did you decide to start your business off of social, like not using social media necessarily? So I've used social media for years and years and years. And what I discovered is that. It is just a trap for me. Because I'm already an anxious person because I already have self doubt and all of those things.

Yes, I am getting better and I'm improving in all of those areas at my old age, but it's still a trap. And what I have seen with my clients is that they want to start a business or they want to grow their business and they get on social media and they're like, well, so and so's already doing this. I'm never going to be successful.

Or they're, they've already got all the clients. Nobody's ever going to hire me. And it's just this constant cycle of doubt and comparison and fear because they're not going to be good enough. And about, I don't remember how long ago it was, I guess maybe almost a year ago. I just heard this solid message, like get off social media.

It's not healthy. And I wasn't getting a lot of clients off of social media. I was getting people on my email list, but I wasn't necessarily getting clients. And so I was like, well, I guess I'll try it and see what happens. And I ended up getting more clients. More discovery calls, more clients. And I was like, okay.

I think I heard him right, right? Now I'll go on periodically. I'll share the podcast or, you know, we'll share a post or if we have a new course or, you know, something like that. For the most part, I'm on there to see what my daughter's doing or my sons are doing and So I'm not on there to grow my business and what has happened is, as a result, I'm following all of these believers and I'm getting great inspiration and I'm also just smiling and having fun or sending things back and forth with my husband that are funny, you know, like, or my sister.

So I've kind of stepped away from the pressure of having to have like all that time there and create content for there. Now we do. My assistant does create content for LinkedIn. And actually what we're doing is all the years of content I had for Instagram, we're just repurposing it to LinkedIn, which is super cool.

So and then we use Pinterest and I use YouTube for the podcast and the podcast and email marketing and. That's it. Search engine optimization, blogging. So there are so many other things that you can do to grow a business without having to spend hours upon hours on a platform that number one, you don't own.

And number two may cause you to go into that. What if, or negative comparison imposter syndrome spiral? I love that God told you to do something and you were obedient and you were blessed abundantly. Like I just always say that God's, God's plan for you is yours specifically. So like, if let's say you were following somebody else who told you no, you need to be on social media every single day.

And then you'd get into that trap of spiraling out of control of being like, Oh, everybody's doing the same thing. I just feel like I'm in echo chamber. Cause that's how it feels sometimes on social media. And God was like, no. I want you off. And then he was like, okay, you're listening to me. You're doing what I'm asking you to do.

Here's even more clients. You, you, I could trust you with a little, here's even more because you're doing it how you need to do it for you to be successful and for my glory. There are tons of people that don't need to be on social. No, and I think we've been, we've been told that you have to be there if you want to grow an online business.

But social media is not the definition of digital marketing. And that's what people have forgotten. There are so many other opportunities. I just listed several of them. And what was really funny was my friend, Stephanie Stephanie Gass had like gone office social periodically. On and off. And I had heard this message and I was in the process of like weaning myself off, making, you know, going through the process of, okay, what am I going to do?

How am I going to shift? And all those things. And I get an email from her and she was like, God told me to get off social media. And I was like, I emailed her and I'm like, Stephanie, you have no idea the timing. Like I swear, God just spoke through you to me, get off social media. And we had a laugh about it because.

You know, that doesn't just happen coincidentally, the fact that I'm going through this decision. And then she pops in my inbox saying, God told her the same thing. I'm like, this was confirmation. I love that. I love that. And so you named like several different ways to grow online. Let's just talk about like lead magnets and growing your email list because you do own that at the end of the day, you don't own YouTube or Instagram or Pinterest or any of those other things, but you do own your email list.

So how do you get people on your email list, especially if you're not on social pitching your things? How does that work for you? Okay. So number one tip is. I'll give you a few tips, but number one is if you have a website and you have worked for SEO to get it SEO optimized, which every single business owner with a website needs to make sure that you have SEO on your website.

So you can, when you name your lead magnet, something that is a keyword or key phrase that, that your clients identify as a solution to their pain point, then you can have that front and center on your website, on the homepage. You can have it on any page, but have it right there at the very top of your homepage and send people to download your free guide, your free ebook, whatever it is that you're giving away for free, your free video training, whatever it is.

Your lead magnets could really be anything. They could be a case study, they could be a white paper, they could be video trainings, they could be a masterclass, they could be a replay, they could be an ebook. So you have a plethora of options, right? But just have that button at the top of your web home page so that people, when they land on your site, They can click there and get started.

They can get to know you. And then another way is that, so you have a podcast, I have a podcast. So this makes this really simple, but at the end of every podcast, a call to action can be download this free ebook related to the topic we just talked about on this podcast episode. Also for the, on the podcast, I'll have an ad that says, Oh, did you know we have all these free resources on our website, go to, and.

The Robyn graham. com forward slash resources and download whatever you'd like to download. Pinterest is a huge, huge, huge way to do this as well because you're driving people to your website so you can drive them to the homepage and they can see that. But most what we do is we drive everybody to our blogs.

So then the during they read the blog and then at the end of the blog there's that call to action to download a free ebook. So that's how we've grown our list. That's how we're growing our list now. I will say that even though I'm not necessarily posting on Instagram every day and Facebook and my, my Pinterest manager is posting to Facebook because we're right now because we're doing a test to see if we're just testing the waters.

But and Facebook was never like a big thing for me in terms of that comparison imposter syndrome and all the mental stuff, but Instagram specifically was. Just get off. Anyway,

anyway I just wanted to clarify that in case anybody went to Facebook and was like, Oh, she's a liar. She's on Facebook. So, but at the top of your Instagram profile, you can actually, well, on the bio part, you can have links. So like in there, we have a link to our free resources in the Pinned posts, the top three pins that you have on not pins, posts on Instagram.

We have one pinned for free resources. So it, but again, that is the ebook 10 strategies to grow your business without social media. So even though we're not necessarily using the platform, we can still have that there. So if people do come to Our site. And then another way to do it too, is if you don't have a podcast, but you guest on podcast, which is an incredible marketing tool, especially if you don't want to be on social media, you can offer that at the end when the host offers you the opportunity to share how people can connect with you or get to know you or, or whatever.

I love that because I feel like some people will create a whole bunch of E things, right? A whole bunch of lead magnets, and then they don't have a spot. That is like more organized to keep people going. They're like, Oh, I made this thing. Oh, it didn't really hit. Right. Let me just do something else. And some of my clients, I'm like, no, just use one.

Like you said, make sure it's SEO where people know exactly what they're getting. It's not overly complicated name. And then just keep pitching that. Like just be known for that one thing in the beginning. And then you can branch out, but people need to know who you are first. That's so good. So good. Yeah.

And in that lead magnet, you want to make sure that it is solving a problem, right? You, you should know as a business owner, what your soulmate clients pain points are. So when you're creating this, whether it's. A masterclass, a video, a ebook, whatever, PDF, make sure that you're hitting on those pain points because that's going to help them understand right away that you get them, you understand them and that you have a solution for them.

And that's going to build trust. Yes, absolutely. So then once you get them on your list, what is your, what, what, what I want to say, what is your like foolproof. Best practice for your welcome sequence. What does that look like for you? Is it like eight emails? Is it six emails? How do you do yours? I currently have five.

And I've had like up to seven, but I have five because they're hearing from me once they're on my list. They're a subscriber now and I'm emailing them at least once a week. So I don't, I don't like to bombard people because I don't like to be bombarded. But the reality is we, we do need to show up to stay front of mind.

So. My sequence is about five emails, and in those I start. The first email is really like, Hey, welcome. Congratulations. You just took the next step to growing your business, whatever. And then that has the down the call to action to download the free whatever it is. And then in that first one. It's kind of a buffet cart for call to actions because I will actually back when the Facebook group was actually really active and everything, I would say you join the Facebook group here and listen to this podcast episode to learn more about establishing your personal brand or Bye.

Whatever that was, I would, so I would give a couple of different calls to action. The second one, then I tell a little bit more about me. So like in my bio, you read that I'm, I'm a wife, I'm a mom, I have two dogs. So I tell a little bit of the personal side of me. And I also give a business tip, but then I have the call to action at the bottom where they can.

Book a call with me if they're ready to take action right away. Then the third email is more social proof. It's a little bit more about me understanding their pain points, my journey, and then the call to action. I can't remember exactly what I have in that one, but maybe like another podcast episode or a blog post.

I'm always trying to drive traffic to my website for SEO. So nine times out of 10, if I'm sending anyone anywhere, it is. So even the podcast, you know, the blogs are the, there's an SEO optimized blog for every podcast episode. It's just how I have grown to be ranked on Google. And then I guess the last one then is more of, are you ready to take action?

Book a call. And that one's all about booking a call with, with another form of social proof. I love that because you're just inviting them, giving them more information, and showing them. Who you are, how you serve. This is what I do. Do you need this information? Do you need this information? Go to my website, check me out, book a call.

Let's get started. And that's all you're doing. You're just inviting them, inviting them, inviting them, and then take action. I love that because sometimes I'll get on an email list and it'll just be too many emails at the beginning. And I'm like, this is, this is too much. I'm out like 10 emails every single day.

I'm like, this is, this is too much. Too much. Yeah, I can't handle it either. And I, I don't like a lot of distractions, so I tried to be short and sweet and simple and it. I think people appreciate that. I mean, my open rates and my, you know, the sustainability in terms of the fact that they don't drop off.

In that nurture sequence, that's significant, but that's another thing that people should look for, right? Like, if you are doing a lead magnet, make sure that people are actually clicking and opening and downloading it. And, you know, then make sure that once that's happening what's happening with those emails?

Are they going to the next step? Are they opening the next email? Are, like, where do they fall off? And then what happens once they start receiving your regular emails? Are they still interested or not? And I don't do, I did one series of Facebook ads last year to try, try to grow the email list doing ads.

And we use the same ebook that I've been referencing. And I know it's a good ebook because everybody stayed on the list for a very long time. We didn't see drop off until after about I guess seven months, we started to see people start dropping off. That's really good. That's really good. Yeah. Yeah. So you want something that really is aligned with your bus, aligned with your business, aligned with your values, hits a pain point for your clients, and it actually has some value to it.

Like you don't wanna give everything away because you want them to hire you, but you want them to see that you're knowledgeable and you know you're gonna provide education, but at the same time. There's so much more that you offer. Yes. And like, like you said, like they need to get to know who you are and get that trust and get that social proof and be like, okay, she's legit.

And they hear you. They hear your voice. They listen to you on the podcast and they're like, she's smart. I like her. Okay. She sent me an email. I will book a call. That's, that's how people get to know you, like you trust you and want to take you to the next step. And it all starts with a really good lead magnet and a really good email sequence.

I love that. Yeah. And social proof. I, you know, if you can take a client's story and. You know, demonstrate through story and then testimonial this that social proof you're going to solidify that relationship with them. They're going to see that you get results for your people that you solve problems. And at the end of the day, that's why people are interested in us, right?

They want us to help them solve their problem. Yes. Absolutely. Absolutely. So what's one thing you learned on this journey on your business journey to become unstoppable? I feel like you're just this unstoppable forest. Like how did you become unstoppable? So I guess the biggest thing for me is that number one, I rely on my faith.

Yes. Two, I have a mindset practice where I am in my daily devotions and I'm journaling. And that is also my creative time. So allowing myself to step into that creativity while being strategic and a little bit techy. I, that creativity has really helped ground me in terms of being able to step forward.

And then the faith and the mindset work together, eliminating the fear and just stepping into courage. Yes. I love that. I love that. Sometimes I think that. Especially as like, well, I'm very techie, like, I feel like creativity is almost like I have to earn creativity. You know what I mean? So I, I always try and put that last.

And then by the end of the day, I'm like, I don't feel like creative at all. Like, I just feel like doing all checking off the boxes. So you're right. Like when I, when I do start with creativity after I've been with God, that's the best time because God is so in tune with what I need to create. Cause he is the ultimate creator.

So it's so good. And you're right. I should probably prioritize that and put it, put it back on the top of the list. I can't tell you how many podcast episodes, how many blog posts, how many social media posts have come out of my morning devotion time. Like I do the, I do the devotions and then I journal and I will just get a flood.

I have, I have like a sketch pad. And sometimes I'll doodle or draw or whatever. At the same time, I'm doing all my. While I'm journaling, whatever, and that sketch pad is just, it's full of ideas, just, and they could be a complete blog post or podcast episode that I just hurt out of my brain onto paper in that time.

It's the first thing in the morning, it's, I feel rejuvenated, I, you know, scripture has inspired me. So it really is that creativity just coming in through. through Jesus, through God, through the Holy Spirit to just guide me them for the rest of the day. Love it. What is your favorite Bible verse and why?

My first, my favorite Bible verse is Jeremiah 29, 11, and it is my favorite verse because of a story related to my father being ill. And in a time when we didn't have a lot of hope, I was just. Arbitrarily sent a plaque that had this verse on it that was like three feet long and, you know, I don't know, eight inches high and 36 inches wide and had that verse on it and it just constantly reminds me that God has a plan for me.

There is hope. He has a future. Plans to prosper me, not to harm me. And whether prosper means an abundance of grace or abundance of revenue, it doesn't matter. It's the fact that he is there and I can stand on solid ground when I have my faith and trust in him. I love that because when we talked before we shared and you talked about that story and it is so good knowing that God, like is the author of our steps and we have no problem just laying on him because it's just so much God is just so good.

And I've just been reminded of that constantly today. And that is just a great verse, especially when you don't know, you don't know what the next is and prosper. Like you said, could just be prosperous and joy, like just the fruits of the spirit now would be okay with that. You know, if it's not financial, like if I had so much self control and so much joy, I'm good.

You know what I mean? So I absolutely love that. Yeah. So how do people connect with you deeper? How do they find you? Is your Facebook group still going? Tell them all about the ebook. The Facebook group is still growth is still going for right now. I don't know where it's going to go, but the best way to find me because absolutely everything is on my website is therobyngraham.com and I would love if this. Resonated with anybody email me. I love to meet people. I just love to get to know who's listening, who heard me, what resonated. So I always welcome emails and that's robyn@therobyngram.com. Oh, thank you so much, Robyn. This has been such a blessing and I will send everybody over to check out your lead magnets.

Maybe they'll even book a call with you. It'll be so great. And thank you so much for being on the podcast. Thanks for having me. It was a joy